Curse

Rico Carridan · Dec 20, 2005, 03:08 AM // 03:08

Well, I've gotten bored of farming griffons and minotaurs with my W/R, and decided to see how I would fare against the legions of grawl located in the Port Sledge area. So far, I've had a great deal of success, but I'm stuck about what to do with the crones. Here's my build so far:

Cyclone Axe
Gladiator's Defense
Bonetti's Defense
Shield Stance
Dolyak Signet
Apply Poison
Healing Sig
Troll Urgent

Axe 16, Tactics 9, Strength 9, Wilderness 7
Zealous axe

Basically, I run into a group of grawls, and gather up the regular hammer ones. Throw on apply poison, D signet, and then use my stances + cyclone axe to kill them. I haven't really had any problems with this part. The problem is, normally after I finish with them, there will be sometimes upward of 6 crones all shooting their wands at me. I can go around and kill them, but they're spread out, so cyclone axe doesn't really work, and they use wands so glad's defense won't hurt them, and they use plague signet, so I can't poison them--so basically it takes me twice as long to kill the leftover crones after I've cleared the grawl, which is really inefficient. I'm wondering if anyone has any suggestions for how I could clear out the crones more efficiently. I don't mind changing secondary, if it comes to that (I'm thinking shield of judgement maybe?)

Rico

bunnys are ebil · Dec 20, 2005, 03:49 AM // 03:49

i think crones have chilblains so well soj wouldnt be so good

Meric Hellhammer · Dec 20, 2005, 04:32 AM // 04:32

First off i would say not to put any points into wilderness survival because with apply poison as long as you keep attacking u wont have to worry about poison duration. Then use the extra points and put em into to tactics so that heal sig is more effective. Last i would say replacing troll ungent with and axe attack like executioners strike to kill the crones quiker. Just my two cents hope it helps.

edit: aswell the rest of u guys (except bunnys are ebil) stfu he wasn't asking ur opinion on his farming spots just how to improve his build.

super dooper · Dec 20, 2005, 05:23 AM // 05:23

this is the build I've been using on them lately (since you mentioned changing secondaries..)

w/mo

12 smiting
7 protection
9 strength (8 + minor rune)
10 tactics (8 + helm + minor rune)

shield of judgement {E}
shielding hands
bonetti's defense
watch yourself
dolyak signet
healing signet
balthazar's spirit
life attunement

weapons: collector smiting staff (20% casting speed and recharge on smiting skills), with an 18% enchanting wrapping. (ivor's staff would work nicely for this, but i'm a cheapo)

general strategy: exit port sledge, cast b. spirit and life attunement on yourself. (making the 10 tactics healing sig heal for 150ish vs. 115ish) head over to the area with a big gathering of grawl/crones, aggro em. hit dolyak signet, start wanding (staffing? :P) a grawl crone, cast shield of judgement, hit watch yourself when you have the adrenaline. try to only use healing signet in the following situations:
- when you have shielding hands up (use it as often as you can/want)
- when you have shield of judgement up
- when you're in bonetti's
because with that many of them hitting you even dolyak signet + watch yourself won't keep you safe while using healing signet. or you can completely disregard those if you're fighting a smaller group.

NOTES: don't move too close to the crones, they do use chilblains, it's fairly easy to keep your distance though. always make sure you're wanding something to help build adrenaline. you can generally kill all the enemies you aggro with 2-3 casts of shield of judgement. so i don't know if that's faster than what you were originally using, but it kills the crones and grawl equally fast. (even though it's not the fastest thing in the world)

now as far as suggestions to your build without switching a secondary, do you find yourself using troll unguent often? if not, then you could swap it out for another axe attack (penetrating blow maybe?) sorry that i can't give more suggestions for the w/r build.

Rico Carridan · Dec 20, 2005, 07:16 AM // 07:16

Thanks for the replies guys, this has given me a lot to think about.

Quote:

Originally Posted by super dooper

this is the build I've been using on them lately (since you mentioned changing secondaries..)

w/mo

12 smiting
7 protection
9 strength (8 + minor rune)
10 tactics (8 + helm + minor rune)

shield of judgement {E}
shielding hands
bonetti's defense
watch yourself
dolyak signet
healing signet
balthazar's spirit
life attunement

That looks interesting, I'll have to give it a try and see how it compares to my present build. I suspect that mine will probably clear the regular grawls quite a bit faster, since I've got more damage skills than you do, but yours certainly will work better for the crones. As for Troll Urgent, well, to be honest, I find that I use it a lot more than healing sig, because I hate the armor loss. If I were to drop any skill on my present build, it would probably be apply poison, since I can only use that on the regular grawls.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meric Hellhammer

First off i would say not to put any points into wilderness survival because with apply poison as long as you keep attacking u wont have to worry about poison duration. Then use the extra points and put em into to tactics so that heal sig is more effective. Last i would say replacing troll ungent with and axe attack like executioners strike to kill the crones quiker. Just my two cents hope it helps.

I usually use apply poison with cyclone axe, so I can poison several grawl at once. If I drop points out of wilderness, I might as well ditch apply poison; the effect won't be worth it for one target.

Rico

R. Mindwalker · Dec 20, 2005, 07:55 AM // 07:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by bunnys are ebil

i think crones have chilblains so well soj wouldnt be so good

Yes they have. And they also have the elite signet Plage Signet. <-- transfers ALL conditions to one target. So using poison is a bit suicide.

Murder In China · Dec 20, 2005, 08:10 AM // 08:10

Just use SoJ at range and have the Crones hit you with their wands.

kvndoom · Dec 20, 2005, 08:56 AM // 08:56

All you have to do is study their behavior. The typical and most common pack of Witman's Grawl is 2 warriors and 2 necros. When you aggro them, the 2 warriors will close in and hit you with their hammers, and one necro (crone) will attack you with his wand from a distance. The other crone, I call the "creeper." If you watch him carefully, you'll notice that he won't attack at all, instead he just slowly but surely inches towards you, until boom! he's in range to cast Chillbains. I used to try to kill the creeper before he got too close by using my Smiting Rod / Staff, but I realized that focusing on him was a waste. So how to do it?

Focus only on the warriors and take them out as fast as possible. Once you've killed both the warriors, the creeper will start to attack normally instead of sneak up on you. Then you can safely attack from a distance. Yes, a DISTANCE. The most inherent flaw with most people who play warrior primaries is that they can't seem to understand that ANY secondary they have can make good use of a ranged weapon. W/R? Well, invest in a good req 8 bow! 15-28 damage is nothing to sneeze at. W/Mo? Where's your Ivor's Staff? W/E? Galigord's Staff + Obsidian Flesh make for mad tanking. 11-22 from a staff or wand is still a good amount of damage. A little flexible out-of-the-box thinking goes a long way. The whole "me run in! me bash!" mentality gets more people killed, I swear...

reboot · Dec 20, 2005, 09:24 AM // 09:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvndoom

The most inherent flaw with most people who play warrior primaries is that they can't seem to understand that ANY secondary they have can make good use of a ranged weapon.

don't try this in pvp...most PvE players that cross over suffer from things like this or thinking that reibirth is the best res.

dont feel no pain · Dec 20, 2005, 01:21 PM // 13:21

i use my hydra build to farm grawls i took out 17 hammer grawls at once but left the crones.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=91567

when i do it i use the same stats but watch yourself insted of defy pain and gladiators defence insted of deadly riposte.

Meric Hellhammer · Dec 20, 2005, 09:15 PM // 21:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rico Carridan

I usually use apply poison with cyclone axe, so I can poison several grawl at once. If I drop points out of wilderness, I might as well ditch apply poison; the effect won't be worth it for one target.

Rico

Thats not true the way apply poison works is that for 24 every attack poisons the target for 3-13 seconds so even with wilderness survival at zero the poison will last for 3 sec, and cyclone recharges in 4. So one sec of no poison isn't going to make much of a differnce. As well it works on every enemie u hit not just on one. And if it make u feel better you can just put enough points into wilderness so that the poison lasts for 4 sec.

Valdis · Dec 20, 2005, 09:35 PM // 21:35

Does farming grawl make you very much money, compaired to ..lets say griffons?
Whats the typical amout of gold dropped per grawl? As far as drops....what normally drops (armors, casting weapons, hammers, swords, shields, axes)?

Rico Carridan · Dec 21, 2005, 12:21 AM // 00:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meric Hellhammer

Thats not true the way apply poison works is that for 24 every attack poisons the target for 3-13 seconds so even with wilderness survival at zero the poison will last for 3 sec, and cyclone recharges in 4. So one sec of no poison isn't going to make much of a differnce. As well it works on every enemie u hit not just on one. And if it make u feel better you can just put enough points into wilderness so that the poison lasts for 4 sec.

I understand your reasoning, and if I weren't using troll urgent, I probably would do it this way, but the way I play, I use troll urgent a lot, so I need the points in wilderness to make it work anyway. I guess I was more thinking of the fact that the poison will wear off very quickly once I have to use Bonetti's, but you're right, assuming I poison them all just before Bonetti's comes on, I'm still only looking at an extra 5-6 seconds of poison anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valdis

Does farming grawl make you very much money, compaired to ..lets say griffons?
Whats the typical amout of gold dropped per grawl? As far as drops....what normally drops (armors, casting weapons, hammers, swords, shields, axes)?

In terms of pure gold value between grawls and griffons, I think they are comparable. Grawls don't drop as many gold coins as griffons, but they drop armors that sell for 50-100g each, and you get a lot of those. On that note, you also get a fair number of runes. I've only done a couple runs and haven't found any particularly valuable ones yet, but presumably you could. The crones drop wands and staffs sometimes, I guess, and the grawls drop hammers, and occasionally other weapons. One of the main reasons why I've moved to grawls, actually, is because they give about 40% more xp than griffons and minotaurs, which is handy for me because I only need a handful more skills to unlock before I've got them all, but I don't have enough skill points yet.

Rico

striderkaaru · Dec 21, 2005, 05:19 PM // 17:19

i used to farm these grawls too.

you can drop apply poison and troll ungent as you really don't need them. put in "watch yourself" and an axe attack like penetrating blow.

only attack the crones. let the hammer grawls get killed by glad defense and cyclone axe, but focus your own attacks against the crones. the extra adrenal axe attack helps with this too. with no poison, they have nothing to send back to you since they never use signet of agony + palgue touch if you are the only target.

The Wisdom Cube · Dec 21, 2005, 05:23 PM // 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvndoom

W/Mo? Where's your Ivor's Staff?

Where could I find one of these? I've heard a lot about them but I don't see a lot of ppl selling them. Or if ppl do sell them how much should I be paying?

(once again kvndoom seems to be the god of guild wars)

(I'm not sucking up at all

)

TnY · Dec 21, 2005, 05:57 PM // 17:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valdis

Does farming grawl make you very much money, compaired to ..lets say griffons?
Whats the typical amout of gold dropped per grawl? As far as drops....what normally drops (armors, casting weapons, hammers, swords, shields, axes)?

I would also like to know why to farm grawls instead of other monsters.

TnY · Dec 23, 2005, 08:26 AM // 08:26

Sorry if this is spam but i'd really like to know a few things, since i just started GW monday and i'd like to start farming as soon as i can..

1.Can you farm grawl from anywhere? I saw a post where a guy said he farmed grawl in pre-searing and got alot of black dyes from it. (That statement alone almost made me build a new w/mo to farm it.)

2.Why farm grawl? Because they have a higher ratio to drop dyes? I've found 2 silver dyes today from gargoyles..

3.What is the best weapon to use against grawls? (or for w/mo farming for that matter.) My guild members said Hammer was the best, but didn't go into detail..
*Is there a way you can reduce the amount you get knocked down against the hammer grawls? I take 1-0 damage from them but getting knocked down sucks, expecially when there are like 5 in a group.

Please also note other decent/not too dificult spots to farm if you could. I'm level 12 right now w/mo.

on a side note- Are 'hydras' T-Rex looking things? If so, i tried fighting one in the midst of a couple grawls and got obliterated. =)

Rico Carridan · Dec 23, 2005, 08:31 AM // 08:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by TnY

Sorry if this is spam but i'd really like to know a few things, since i just started GW monday and i'd like to start farming as soon as i can..

1.Can you farm grawl from anywhere? I saw a post where a guy said he farmed grawl in pre-searing and got alot of black dyes from it. (That statement alone almost made me build a new w/mo to farm it.)

I haven't found any black dyes from the higher level grawls. I've found other dyes occasionally, but no more often than say griffons drop them. The advantage to pre-searing farming is that *every* monster gives a drop, whereas in other areas they don't. Pre-searing does seem to have a higher rate to drop dyes, particularly black dyes, but I don't have any empirical evidence to that fact, just what I've noticed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TnY

2.Why farm grawl? Because they have a higher ratio to drop dyes? I've found 2 silver dyes today from gargoyles..

I don't farm them for dyes, I farm them for the xp and loot they drop, mainly runes from armors, or the armors themselves I can sell or salvage. The grawls I'm farming are level 22 by the way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TnY

3.What is the best weapon to use against grawls? (or for w/mo farming for that matter.) My guild members said Hammer was the best, but didn't go into detail..
*Is there a way you can reduce the amount you get knocked down against the hammer grawls? I take 1-0 damage from them but getting knocked down sucks, expecially when there are like 5 in a group.

I don't recommend farming with hammer because the extra AL from the shield (and in my case, 45 health and -2 damage reduction) is hard to pass up. I prefer to farm with axe, but sword would probably work just as well. For the knockdowns, take Dolyak signet (preferred) or balanced stance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TnY

Please also note other decent/not too dificult spots to farm if you could. I'm level 12 right now w/mo.

on a side note- Are 'hydras' T-Rex looking things? If so, i tried fighting one in the midst of a couple grawls and got obliterated. =)

At your level, if you can manage it, I think charr are probably your best bet to farm. I can't think of any area where you find both hydras and grawl at the same time--in the early game, you can find them in the region west of Courthouse, or in the region after the Althea's ashes quest, later, you'll see them a lot in Crystal desert (preferred hydra farming area... actually, probably one of the preferred farming areas overall in the game) and some in the Ring of Fire area. They use meteor, and some other elementalists skills, which make them difficult to defeat if you aren't properly prepared. Honestly though, I don't see any real reason to farm at your level. I'm guessing this is your first time through, so I would just play through normally and worry about farming once you've finished the main mission quests. Higher level farming tends to be more rewarding, and if people do farm lower level creatures, they probably do it with high level equipment if they can (pre-searing farming excluded)

Rico

yunthi · Oct 25, 2006, 11:11 PM // 23:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvndoom

The most inherent flaw with most people who play warrior primaries is that they can't seem to understand that ANY secondary they have can make good use of a ranged weapon.

a bit off the topic but i actually created a build for w/r using bow

primal rage[E]
signet of str
read the wind
favorable winds
troll ugument
endure pain
antidote sign
rez sign

atributes :
str15
marksmanship 12
wilderness survival 6

based on str giving u 15% armor piercing + inherent armor piercing from a horn bow + 20% armor piercing from primal rage (+ most hits are critical using this one)

+ the spirits an signet u will do about 60 - 110 / attack geared on the higher hits cuz of as said most hits being criticals... also this does only a little less dmg for warriors cuz of high armor penetration

this is about ½ year old so might act a bit differently from then but i had my fun in pvp with this (actually owned many primary rangers with this one) tho as said, havent used this in ages

-.- · Oct 25, 2006, 11:13 PM // 23:13

Thread necromancy ftl.